LETTER OF
The GOSPEL TRUTH CHARLES G. FINNEY
1873
To the Editor of the Examiner and Chronicle
10 June 1873
[Ms in the handwriting of Mrs. Rebecca Rayl Finney, in the Finney Papers, Addendum, Microfilm, roll 8]
The following document accompanies the manuscript of the letter:
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1st The Reason for my Reply.
2nd In my first article, I said the Lord sent me to
Gouverneur. Quote from the Ms History of the
church, written by Mr. Smith, to sustain the
point.
3d I said that Hervey D. Smith was a skeptic, or
Deist. Quote Mrs. Smith's letter upon this
subject.
4th I went to Gouverneur in the spring either
late in April, or early in May. Quote Ms.
history. 2 Quote Oneida Circular.
5th Elder Barrell says the revival began
in June, in the Baptist church, and that after-
wards I was sent for, to labor in the Presbyterian
church. The above shows that Elder B. was
mistaken.
6th I said, that in our private interview Elder
B agreed not to proselyte, He denies this,
and justifies his proselyting, by assuming that it
would be compromising the truth of God, to
delay the reception of members until the revival
had spent its force I can not see how this
would follow.
7th Elder B. says that I admitted that immer
sion was the primitive mode of Baptism. I
am sure that I never entertained this opinion.
I maintained the contrary of this, in that discussion.
I have always taught, as the multitudes who have
been taught by me, can testify, that immersion
was not the primitive mode of baptism,
and that the concession by some persons, that
it was, was made without due consideration
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and a thorough mastery of the subject.
I am by no means disposed to consider these
questions, as questions of veracity, but as
questions of memory relating to facts that occur-
red nearly half a century ago. Elder B. denies
8th Elder B. denies that I had said that a proselyting
Baptist minister came there and lectured on
the subject of baptism, which led to my
discussion of the subject. Here Elder B. forgets
again, and asserts that no Baptist minister
was there, except upon one occasion. Daniel
Keyes & others, remember the facts substantially as
I remember them. Quote Oneida Circular.
Also Mrs. Smith's last letter.
9th. I said that some Baptist families united with
the Presbyterian church before I left Gouvrneur.
Answer. Quote Mrs. Smith's letter
10th Elder B. represents Joel Keys represents
as fearing that he was in the wrong church,
and that he left the Presbyterian and joined
the Baptist church. The records of the Presbyterian
church show that Joel Keys was never a member
of that church. His brother, Daniel Keys says he
was a member of a Congregational church in
Vermont. There is no record of any one's leaving
the Presbyterian church and joining the Baptist
until the autumn of that year, when one or
females
two ^ withdrew from the Presbyterian church for
that purpose.
1
Oberlin June 10th 1873
Editor of the Examiner and Chronicle,
Dear Sir, I have seen
the articles in your paper, denying the truthfulness of my
account of the revival in Gouverneur in 1825. Ill health,
the weakness of my eyes, & ignorance of the whereabouts of
certain parties, whose re collections of the facts, I wished to
consult, has postponed my public notice of those articles
until now. I had, several years since, at the earnest request
of many christian friends, written out from memory a
condensed account of the principal revivals in which I
have labored during my ministry. This manuscript
book, is not yet published. My memory has always
been, as I believe, remarkably tenacious. The account
I gave of the revival in Gouverneur in the Independent
was not an extract form the Mss. volume, but was
written independently of that, though it contained in
substance the same facts. My principal object in con-
sulting the recollections of others, regarding that revival
has been, not to contradict what my Baptist brethren have
said, but to justify the accuracy of my own remembrance
of the facts. I will be as brief as possible in this
article and touch only upon the main points of dis-
crepancy, between the recollections of my Baptist Brethren,
and my own.
1st The manner of my going to Gouverneur. I said in
substance, that I was not invited by man, but went
at the bidding of God. A friend has sent me from the
records of the Presbyterian church at Gouverneur as follows,
on this point. Speaking of Bro. Nash & myself, "They
came uninvited by man, but sent of God." Elder
Barrell is therefore mistaken, in saying that the Pres.
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church sent for me.
2nd The time of my going. Elder Barrell says that "The
revival commenced in the Baptist church in June
when several were received to the Baptist church". "After
that after the Presbyterian church sent for me."
The record in the Pres. church book, to which I have
alluded, says of Bro. Nash & myself, that one
of us arrived in April, and the other in May. The
recollections of the brethren at Gouverneur, as reported
to an agent of the Oneida circular are, that "Mr. Finney
and Father Nash were here, from April to September".
This is true. I sent Father Nash a few days before
me, in the last of April, and arrived myself
either in the last of April, or about the first of
May. The revival commenced immediately upon my
arrival, as I have related. Elder Barrell is therefore
mistaken in saying that the revival commenced
in Gouverneur in June.
3d In my first article I related the conversion of
Hervey D. Smith, and said he was a Deist. Some of
the Baptist brethren in Gouverneur wrote "Hervey D.
Smith was never an infidel." Under the date of
April 14th Mrs. Smith his widow writes, "I consider
your account," speaking of her husband's conversion,
"correct in all essential particulars."
4th I said in my article that after discussion on
the subject of Baptism, some Baptist families united
with the Presbyterian church. Elder Barrell says
that no one forsook him to join the Presbyterians. I did not say
they did. But I understood at the time, that they were Baptists.
A most reliable member of the Presbyterian church, upon
this point, writes me, as follows. "Those who united
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with our church, after the discussion you refer to,
who were members of the Baptist society. I do not cer-
tainly know if any of them were ever communicants
in the Baptist church," (i.e. in Gouverneur.) "Aas many
new inhabitants were coming in , and we had been
residents but little over a year." I understand
they were Baptists, as this writer does, but I did not know
whether or not they had joined the Baptist church in
that place, and never thought to raise the question.
5th Elder Barrell represents Joel Keyes as having left the
Presbyterian church, because he found "he was
in the wrong church," and joined the Baptists, after
the discussion of the subject in his house, of which I knew
nothing. A friend who has thoroughly examined the record
of the Pres. church, writes as follows, "Mr. Joel Keyes,
whose name he (Elder Barrell) mentioned, was never
a member of our church." From another source I
learn that Joel Keyes had been a member of a Con-
gregational church in Vermont, but had never
united with the Presbyterian church in Gouverneur.
It is very likely that the Baptist families that united
with the Pres. church when I was there, had been
members of Baptist churches east, but having recently
arrived in Gouverneur, had not joined the Baptist
church there, as my friend suggests.
6. Brother Barrell's account of his interview with me
previous to my differs marvelously, from my recollection
of the interview. He says that I admitted to him, that
immersion was the primitive mode of Baptism. This remark
will surprise the many that I have taught upon the this subject,
who know that I have always taught the contrary. I
certainly never held that opinion, but have uniformly
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that that concession
insisted, ^ by whomsoever made, was loosely made, and
was
not warranted by historic truth. He does not deny,
but justifies the proselyting which I deplored, and
which forced me to publicly discuss the question.
7th Brother Barrell does not recollect, but denies,
that Elder Freeman came there at the time I
mentioned, and lectured on the subject of Baptism.
But some of the Baptists at Gouverneur remember
his being there. The agent of the Oneida circular affirms
that he had carefully questioned different parties in
Gouverneur, and writes "Daniel Keyes, and others, who
have not yet seen the Independent, told the same
story about the Baptist controversy, that Mr. Finney
reported." These were probably Presbyterians, but a most reliable
member of the Pres. Church, writes as follows, "The Baptist
sister, of whom I wrote in my last, said she remembered
Elder Freeman's visit here, but was prevented by ill
health, from attending the meetings ( i.e. his meetings)
much."
8 I represented Elder Freeman as being present
on the last day of my discussion, and as going out,
and as being found by a Deacon of the Pres. church,
who led out a little child, sitting in the vestibule, and
weeping, at the close of my remarks. This same Deacon
writes under date of May 24th 1873. "You need not
doubt, that I saw Elder Freeman weeping, in the
vestibule of the church, as I told you." In reference
to leading out the little child, he says "James, the little
one whom I led out of church, as you may recollect,
died at Watertown in 1846." Thus, I find the accuracy
of my memory confirmed by the recollection of others.
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9th I said in my article that after I left, the Baptist church
dismissed their minister, and worshipped for some
time, with the Presbyterians. I derived my information
on this point, some years after I left Gouverneur,
from parties whose veracity, I did not at all
question. But as this is denied by some of the Baptist
brethren at Gouverneur, it is probable that I was
misinformed. I am not at all disposed to call in
question the veracity of Elder Barrell, or any
of the brethren, whose recollections differ from my
own, in regard to these questions. Indeed, they cannot
justly be considered questions of veracity, but only
of memory, and as the facts in question occurred
nearly a half a century ago, it were unchristian
to call in question each others veracity, instead
of understanding our differences as only matters
of memory.